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spudboy
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 3:17 am  Reply with quote
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Mad It just chaps my ass to no end that Backwards was just put aside for like ten or twelve years and all they did was tempt us with shitty little leaked tracks every so often.

Without knowing the whole backstory, I'm just going to blame Trent.

It's just easier that way.....
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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:28 am  Reply with quote
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spudboy wrote:
Mad It just chaps my ass to no end that Backwards was just put aside for like ten or twelve years and all they did was tempt us with shitty little leaked tracks every so often.

Without knowing the whole backstory, I'm just going to blame Trent.

It's just easier that way.....


I'm not too bothered actually. If Reznor had released it back in the early 90's we probably wouldn't have had the new versions of the tracks we were treated to on Ape and now on The New Backwards. The demos were all pretty half baked anyway, which I'm sure was the reason they were never officially put out.
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nhtp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:51 am  Reply with quote
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blipseed wrote:
spudboy wrote:
Mad It just chaps my ass to no end that Backwards was just put aside for like ten or twelve years and all they did was tempt us with shitty little leaked tracks every so often.

Without knowing the whole backstory, I'm just going to blame Trent.

It's just easier that way.....


I'm not too bothered actually. If Reznor had released it back in the early 90's we probably wouldn't have had the new versions of the tracks we were treated to on Ape and now on The New Backwards. The demos were all pretty half baked anyway, which I'm sure was the reason they were never officially put out.


Exactly, I think that the quality of the tracks that we hear now are better thatn what we would have got in the 90's. What beats me is that these new tracks get such a limited release.It's kinda like the first issue of 'Musick to play in the dark' which was also so incredebli good, but was only released in 500 issues (or something like that).

But then again, that's how Coil has always been.

I can highly recommend the interview with Sleazt higher up in the thread. From that it seems that these new tracks are the ones they (or he) just didn't like as much. Mind boggling.

Peter Christopherson = Genius

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chickenf1sh
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:06 am  Reply with quote
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It's definitely got the magic Coil touch, which has been missing from some of the post-mortem Coil tracks Sleazy has been putting out (eg Black Antlers bonus disc, Absinthe disc).

"Copacabbala" is my initial fave, probably cos of the Balance vocals/lyrics.

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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:07 am  Reply with quote
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chickenf1sh wrote:
It's definitely got the magic Coil touch, which has been missing from some of the post-mortem Coil tracks Sleazy has been putting out (eg Black Antlers bonus disc, Absinthe disc).

"Copacabbala" is my initial fave, probably cos of the Balance vocals/lyrics.


Exactly my first thoughts. I haven't been a huge fan of the extra "Coil" material Sleazy put on to the Remote Viewer and Black Antlers 2CD editions, and the Absinthe track which is fairly poor. But this is class stuff, and some of it probably better than some of the Ape tracks. The Balance contribution is to the fore also, they aren't just instrumental versions of older tracks, which is what makes them so good, and so Coil. I can't overstate how chuffed I am with these tunes. It was sad that Ape was going to be the last actual Coil release, so to hear The New Backwards now is amazing. Easily release of the year so far.

Haven't decided what my favourite track is yet, it's too hard!
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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:17 am  Reply with quote
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nhtp wrote:
What beats me is that these new tracks get such a limited release.It's kinda like the first issue of 'Musick to play in the dark' which was also so incredebli good, but was only released in 500 issues (or something like that).

But then again, that's how Coil has always been.

I can highly recommend the interview with Sleazt higher up in the thread. From that it seems that these new tracks are the ones they (or he) just didn't like as much. Mind boggling.

Peter Christopherson = Genius


I'd bet my house on a future CD release of these tunes. You never know, they might have even held on to a couple of extra tracks to make the CD release attractive to vinyl owners. Sleazy has his head screwed on, and if there's money to be made he'll make it.

They have always been obssessed with limited editions (I actually have a couple of handwritten letters from Balance to a collector from about 87 talking about various limited editions enthusiastically, including the famous "skidmarked" coloured vinyl of Scatology!!), but generally as extra "special editions", there has almost always been an unlimited version of most things, give or take the odd release. The first, and only, vinyl edition of Musick Vol.1 was limited to 500, but the CD was 2000. Then the CD got a fairly hefty repress along with Vol.2 two or three years later. If there is demand for something it will be released.
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nhtp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:19 am  Reply with quote
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blipseed wrote:
chickenf1sh wrote:
It's definitely got the magic Coil touch, which has been missing from some of the post-mortem Coil tracks Sleazy has been putting out (eg Black Antlers bonus disc, Absinthe disc).

"Copacabbala" is my initial fave, probably cos of the Balance vocals/lyrics.


Exactly my first thoughts. I haven't been a huge fan of the extra "Coil" material Sleazy put on to the Remote Viewer and Black Antlers 2CD editions, and the Absinthe track which is fairly poor. But this is class stuff, and some of it probably better than some of the Ape tracks. The Balance contribution is to the fore also, they aren't just instrumental versions of older tracks, which is what makes them so good, and so Coil. I can't overstate how chuffed I am with these tunes. It was sad that Ape was going to be the last actual Coil release, so to hear The New Backwards now is amazing. Easily release of the year so far.

Haven't decided what my favourite track is yet, it's too hard!


Great to hear other peoples enthusiasm that matches your own! I sort of agree on your opinions on the extra tracks for Remote Viewer and Black Antlers, since they don't bring anything significantly new to the tracks we already knew. However, I play them together with the rest of the tunes when listening to those albums, and in that context I enjoy them.

I think that the last era of Coil (Black Antlers, Ape of Naples, New Backwards, Remote Viewing etc.) was probably the best they ever had. I really can't express how much I love that music.....

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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:26 am  Reply with quote
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nhtp wrote:

I think that the last era of Coil (Black Antlers, Ape of Naples, New Backwards, Remote Viewing etc.) was probably the best they ever had. I really can't express how much I love that music.....


I don't know, it's hard to look past the Musick 1&2 / Astral Disaster / Equinox Solstice Series for me. Even Scatology/Horse Rotorvator will beat almost anything these days. I think the only weak period, although I should say "relatively" weak, were the clubbing years, The Snow, Windowpane etc. even though I love LSD and Stolen and Contaminated Songs. Then you've got the wilderness years which provided Black Light District, Worship The Glitch and Time Machines! There's a good reason why Coil are my favourite band!
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nhtp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:48 am  Reply with quote
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blipseed wrote:
nhtp wrote:

I think that the last era of Coil (Black Antlers, Ape of Naples, New Backwards, Remote Viewing etc.) was probably the best they ever had. I really can't express how much I love that music.....


I don't know, it's hard to look past the Musick 1&2 / Astral Disaster / Equinox Solstice Series for me. Even Scatology/Horse Rotorvator will beat almost anything these days. I think the only weak period, although I should say "relatively" weak, were the clubbing years, The Snow, Windowpane etc. even though I love LSD and Stolen and Contaminated Songs. Then you've got the wilderness years which provided Black Light District, Worship The Glitch and Time Machines! There's a good reason why Coil are my favourite band!


You said it....

It really doesn't make sense to try at judge something as being better than the rest.

Many of my friends are proffesional classical musicians, and haven't heard anything like this ever. I keep on making plans to play some Coil for them to appreciate how new, different and creative music can be, without loosing universal factors such as melody and beauty. I just never get around to do it...

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chickenf1sh
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:20 pm  Reply with quote
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There is no weak period for COIL! That's one of the reasons why they're my desert island band of choice...

I find it amusing that there is more discussion of this release going on here than on the Coil mailing list.

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nhtp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:26 pm  Reply with quote
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chickenf1sh wrote:
There is no weak period for COIL! That's one of the reasons why they're my desert island band of choice...

I find it amusing that there is more discussion of this release going on here than on the Coil mailing list.


Heh, I remeber being on that list a looong time ago, and it was almost completely dead...

Inteligent people listen to inteligent music, hence this interest in Coil on this forum.

You may shoot me for that last statement. If you can find me among all the raping and killing that us scaninavians like so much.

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fish
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:35 pm  Reply with quote
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i could do without most of the LSD era stuff. i didn't love it then and i like it even less now. Horse Rotovator and Musick vol 1 are my 2 personal fav albums of theirs. But rarely do they release anything that i just don't like at all. I was pleasantly surprised to like this New Backwards as much as i do with "careful what you wish for" being my favorite track.

Coil has a mailing list/forum? where is it and is it worthwhile at all?
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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:11 pm  Reply with quote
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chickenf1sh wrote:

I find it amusing that there is more discussion of this release going on here than on the Coil mailing list.


fish wrote:
Coil has a mailing list/forum? where is it and is it worthwhile at all?


No, unfortunately it is not worthwhile at all. It used to be a great buzzing community back in the day, great trading and chat, but it has dwindled down to maybe half a dozen regular posters who spend their time bickering like schoolkids, and who don't take kindly to newbies poking their heads in. It's a long time since I was a regular poster and I barely even read the emails now. But I did notice the lack of feedback regarding Backwards. Probably none of them have actually bothered to buy it!
Interestingly, two of the regulars are John Several of Tactile, previous runner of Sentrax which released Lull, Final, God and Cable Regime, and Steve "Fez" Fesinger of Terminal Cheesecake.

If you really must sign up for a look the details are here...

http://www.hollyfeld.org/mailman/listinfo/coil

There used to be a Coil forum here

http://coil.vanleeuwen.to/

but it was a bit of a flop so he has shut up shop. This site used to have a few live sets for free download but I see now he is trying to charge for them. Tut tut.
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fish
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:28 pm  Reply with quote
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Thanks for the info. i used to hit the "coilmart" right on brainwashed's site a good 10 years ago around the song of the week days. got some great stuff via trades off of there and r.m.i. back then. those were the days... its' too bad it all went to shit.
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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:54 pm  Reply with quote
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fish wrote:
Thanks for the info. i used to hit the "coilmart" right on brainwashed's site a good 10 years ago around the song of the week days. got some great stuff via trades off of there and r.m.i. back then. those were the days... its' too bad it all went to shit.


Ah Coilmart!! I have very fond memories of that little spot, I'm still in touch with some guys I encountered on there. And it was the source of some of my most precious finds, including the Gold Is The Metal Deluxe Edition!
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spudboy
PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:21 pm  Reply with quote
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In college, I would scrimp and save odd change, beer money, etc..... even go so far as donating plasma twice a week for $20 a pop, just so I could trudge into the local record store and hit the "Import" section each month to buy Coil CD's.

Funny thing is that most of those original, hard-won discs have suffered severe DISC ROT over the last ten years or more and are inoperable.

Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad Mad
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chickenf1sh
PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:38 pm  Reply with quote
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Spudboy: PDO (who more than likely manufactured the rotting discs) were replacing them free-of-charge up until about Nov 2006. They have been taken over, but the new company details (EDC) can be found at the bottom of this page:
http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/bronzed.asp

This page also recommends contacting the original label, but as World Serpent went tits up a few years ago that's not really an option...

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blipseed
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 12:36 pm  Reply with quote
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I see the first copies of the red vinyl version of Ape have already appeared on eBay, a snip at $455! Another going now for $420, even snippier!
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nhtp
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 12:38 pm  Reply with quote
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blipseed wrote:
I see the first copies of the red vinyl version of Ape have already appeared on eBay, a snip at $455! Another going now for $420, even snippier!


Sometimes I really wonder who the sellers of these things are.... I mean, it's not like everyone knows just how rare and wabted these things are.

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Streetcleaner
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:16 pm  Reply with quote
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I don't own one Coil CD. Too expensive. I just downloaded their entire discography instead. I love just being able to instantly get anything I want. I cannot think of how hard it used to be to discover new music.
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blipseed
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:48 am  Reply with quote
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Streetcleaner wrote:
I don't own one Coil CD. Too expensive. I just downloaded their entire discography instead. I love just being able to instantly get anything I want. I cannot think of how hard it used to be to discover new music.


Thanks for sharing.
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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 1:26 pm  Reply with quote
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Streetcleaner wrote:
I don't own one Coil CD. Too expensive. I just downloaded their entire discography instead. I love just being able to instantly get anything I want. I cannot think of how hard it used to be to discover new music.


the clap!

I'm happy for you.

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nothinger
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 2:24 pm  Reply with quote
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But maybe he somehow pointed out the stupidity of idea releasing each new album in ultra-limited and ultra-expensive edition and spend more time on making ass-kicking artwork than music (none Coil album in maybe 5 years was as good to get it for so much money...)?
Same goes for C93, NWW and maybe others.

And you know it's not the matter of "me being mean for not having money to afford it"...

Just my few cents (almost literally).
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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 2:51 pm  Reply with quote
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A) It's not a new album (well part of it is sort of)

B) No new Coil in years because Coil died the day Balance Died.

C) Sleazy has a bunch of stuff coming out soon

D) Coil's done these ltd thingies since they started in '84.

E) They generally keep a majority of their stuff in print and it's not expensive. You can also buy Flac's of alot of their output directly from Sleazy. And they are not expensive.

F) If one is that "fed up" with ltd releases then don't buy them. Plain and simple. I didn't buy the Ape box as I have the album on CD and it was just too expensive for me. Oh well. I'm not all busted up by that fact. Yes I DL'd the New Backwards. And yes if it gets a stand alone release on vinyl or CD I will buy it.

G) Just stating. "Too expensive so I DL'd ALL of it! LOL!" is just dumb. There's absolutely no point in coming into a thread and saying that. If one wants to start a discussion about this topic there are better ways to do it.

H) There is nothing stupid about releasing or creating art. Of any knid. In any number. The backlash comes from people who can't have it right away or can't afford it or miss out on it. And it's always music related. You never hear complaints about artists fine art prints being expensive and ltd. Cause they are.

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nothinger
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 4:30 pm  Reply with quote
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Yeah, I know - "if you don't like it, simply don't buy it". But as a fan of Coil I want completely new stuff or no stuff at all and not some new-old reworked material, which simply just isn't as good as the old one - Sleazy dissolves their talent in series of re-issues just for money. I don't like it whatever it's priced.
She should just put Jhonn and Coil to rest and release his solo stuff, as I really liked Threshouldhouse Boy's Choir release.
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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 4:40 pm  Reply with quote
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What series of reissues? If your talking Remote Viewer/Black Antlers, he took ltd releases and made them widely available at a reasonable price so everyone could get them. And with the (supposedly) forthcoming reissues as well. To complain about reissues is in direct contrast to your post. I'm not being a dick or coming at you or anything but I find it odd. As far as the New Backwards goes, it suits the Ape stuff and works very well as a companion piece. And as far as I know was sourced from the same material. Sleazy does certainly have the right to go back and do whatever he damn well pleases to the coil catalog. That said, I look forward to SoiSong. And yes the HouseBoys choir release is excellent.

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spudboy
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:50 pm  Reply with quote
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I couldn't afford the Threshold House Boys Choir CD, so I instantly downloaded their entire catalogue, including all the stuff they haven't even recorded yet...

you should hear it, it's AWESOME!!!!
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blipseed
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:23 am  Reply with quote
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Agree with everything IDNG said above. The fact that anybody is actually complaining that Sleazy is making available old/unreleased/out of print Coil while at the same time complaining about price and lack of availability is making me scratch my head.

By the way IDNG, have you been taking face furniture tips from our Mr. Balance?? sniggering

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Streetcleaner
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:05 am  Reply with quote
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I Don't Need God wrote:
A) It's not a new album (well part of it is sort of)

B) No new Coil in years because Coil died the day Balance Died.

C) Sleazy has a bunch of stuff coming out soon

D) Coil's done these ltd thingies since they started in '84.

E) They generally keep a majority of their stuff in print and it's not expensive. You can also buy Flac's of alot of their output directly from Sleazy. And they are not expensive.

F) If one is that "fed up" with ltd releases then don't buy them. Plain and simple. I didn't buy the Ape box as I have the album on CD and it was just too expensive for me. Oh well. I'm not all busted up by that fact. Yes I DL'd the New Backwards. And yes if it gets a stand alone release on vinyl or CD I will buy it.

G) Just stating. "Too expensive so I DL'd ALL of it! LOL!" is just dumb. There's absolutely no point in coming into a thread and saying that. If one wants to start a discussion about this topic there are better ways to do it.

H) There is nothing stupid about releasing or creating art. Of any knid. In any number. The backlash comes from people who can't have it right away or can't afford it or miss out on it. And it's always music related. You never hear complaints about artists fine art prints being expensive and ltd. Cause they are.


Wrong.

Coil is ridiculously hard to get and some of their albums are "overpriced" for the average person. And they are the type of band where one release doesn't sound like the other, so it's imperative that you take the time to absorb all of their work. At least, this was true back in 2006 when I was first getting into them. I was just making a note that downloading all of their stuff is an alternative for people who do not feel like waiting/paying through the ass for one of their releases. Someday I will probably buy some of their albums simply because I am a completionist and for the fact that mp3 quality audio doesn't do any band justice. Other than that, I really don't understand what's to get so anal about here. If you don't like what I have to say, then simply ignore it. Doesn't seem too hard to me.
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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:38 pm  Reply with quote
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blipseed wrote:
Agree with everything IDNG said above. The fact that anybody is actually complaining that Sleazy is making available old/unreleased/out of print Coil while at the same time complaining about price and lack of availability is making me scratch my head.

By the way IDNG, have you been taking face furniture tips from our Mr. Balance?? sniggering



Holy Crap! I didn't even realize the similarity in beards! Amazing! I've not seen that pic in a while. I've not been to the direct Threshold House site in a while.

Blip - Exactly my point.



Quote:
I was just making a note that downloading all of their stuff is an alternative for people who do not feel like waiting/paying through the ass for one of their releases.


Do you not see the glaring mistake in this statement? Oh well... Most of their stuff is available. And reasonably priced. It seems you are mistaken about Coil. Blip can back me up. As can random Coil searches on teh innarwebs. My problem is not with DLing. If you are just getting into a band that has a huge, sprawling back catalog then DLing some stuff to check it out is fine. But your in original post you were trumpeting the fact you didn't own one of their discs cause they cost too much. Blah blah blah. Last I'll say on it. Here's some Cheap trick for you...


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Wilhelm_Stroker
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:50 pm  Reply with quote
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I couldn't agree more with IDNG. Coil stuff is not that hard to get and not that expensive. If you can't be bothered making a little effort...
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nhtp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:54 pm  Reply with quote
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Wilhelm_Stroker wrote:
I couldn't agree more with IDNG. Coil stuff is not that hard to get and not that expensive. If you can't be bothered making a little effort...


What you said...

And to further elaborate:

http://thresholdhouse.greedbag.com/

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blipseed
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:07 am  Reply with quote
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Coil just have that rep because of the special and art editions they often released along with regular issues. Note ALONG WITH. And if you were really into Coil you would know that. Obviously the limited editions fetch high prices. But very very rarely have they ever released music that was only ever available as a limited edition. Restitution Of Decayed Intelligence, pHILM, Nasa-Arab and New Backwards are the only two that spring immediately to mind. Anyway, there are obviously some people in this thread who know what they're talking about and some who don't, so there's not really much left to be said on the topic. If anybody wants to brag about how much they illegally download perhaps you could start your own thread about it.
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spudboy
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:25 am  Reply with quote
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The nice thing about Coil was, no matter how many obscure and limited releases there were, most of it eventually got compiled and released in a more attainable form (ie. Unnatural Histories, Gold is the Metal, Stolen & Contaminated Songs, etc.)

As they themselves said "Persistence is all."
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Streetcleaner
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:27 am  Reply with quote
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If you people actually think that I am bragging about downloading mp3's then that has more to do with your own underlining insecurity problems than what I said. Let's do a recap here: A while back I saw Horse Rotorvator listed somewhere under a 60-80 dollar price tag. I thought, like any other ordinary person would, that the price for that CD was absurd. So, yes, I downloaded their entire discography instead.... It was just a simple, tiny anecdote that some of you have chosen to blow out of proportion.
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nhtp
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:26 pm  Reply with quote
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I just found this:



http://cgi.ebay.com/Orginal-Beatles-Album_W0QQitemZ260223103086QQihZ016QQcategoryZ306QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

and thought fuck no, 3500$! That's pricey! Now I have the entire Beatles catalog downloaded. That'll teach them!!!

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Streetcleaner
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:34 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 11 May 2007
Posts: 2145

nhtp wrote:
I just found this:



http://cgi.ebay.com/Orginal-Beatles-Album_W0QQitemZ260223103086QQihZ016QQcategoryZ306QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

and thought fuck no, 3500$! That's pricey! Now I have the entire Beatles catalog downloaded. That'll teach them!!!


^

Waste of hard drive space.
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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:45 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 9422

Streetcleaner wrote:
If you people actually think that I am bragging about downloading mp3's then that has more to do with your own underlining insecurity problems than what I said.


lol Donut

Quote:
Let's do a recap here: A while back I saw Horse Rotorvator listed somewhere under a 60-80 dollar price tag. I thought, like any other ordinary person would, that the price for that CD was absurd. So, yes, I downloaded their entire discography instead.... It was just a simple, tiny anecdote that some of you have chosen to blow out of proportion.


"I did one quick search on amazon or ebay and saw someone selling it at an inflated price, like people are want to do on those sites, and figured why bother searching anywhere else when I can just have it all now. You guys think that's cool right? Guys?"

@nhtp - lol

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Streetcleaner
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:03 pm  Reply with quote
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I Don't Need God wrote:
Streetcleaner wrote:
If you people actually think that I am bragging about downloading mp3's then that has more to do with your own underlining insecurity problems than what I said.


lol Donut

Quote:
Let's do a recap here: A while back I saw Horse Rotorvator listed somewhere under a 60-80 dollar price tag. I thought, like any other ordinary person would, that the price for that CD was absurd. So, yes, I downloaded their entire discography instead.... It was just a simple, tiny anecdote that some of you have chosen to blow out of proportion.


"I did one quick search on amazon or ebay and saw someone selling it at an inflated price, like people are want to do on those sites, and figured why bother searching anywhere else when I can just have it all now. You guys think that's cool right? Guys?"

@nhtp - lol


Well, damn, you are right!

Congratulations.

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I Don't Need God
PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:13 pm  Reply with quote
Heretic


Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 9422

Who was arguing in that post? Having a bit of fun maybe...


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